RogerTheAlien wrote:

Arabdownsouth wrote:

RogerTheAlien wrote:

 
Dave’s a tidy player but i just don’t think he’s suited for the Scottish game.

 
He's in the latest training video so perhaps it's all smoke and no fire?

 
Heard he injured his groin a few weeks back…

Seen Sibbald training too in the video, get him back soon when 100%.

 
I wouldn't be totally surprised to see Sibbs on the bench tomorrow. Just a hunch nothing more.

Paton confirmed
 

Last edited by Tek (20/1/2025 6:45 pm)

Tangy wrote:

Beardy23 wrote:

https://youtu.be/ARUncwJdStQ?si=u0lPfi6MBnTZsqqK
Paton confirmed
 

 Get him on the phones immediately.... I miss press tree Sean dillon

https://www.dundeeunitedfc.co.uk/news/8764/FORMER-MAN-CITY-STARLET-LEWIS-FIORINI-LOANED-IN-FOR-REMAINDER-OF-SEASON.html

Beardy23 wrote:

both Forini and Paton have scored more goals at Tannadice than Van Der Sande

 
🤣🤣

Add Rory Boulding to that list,at least his was in a United shirt.

Last edited by Arabdownsouth (20/1/2025 7:01 pm)

I get why folk don't rate Van der Sande.
And I do think there will come a time when we don't need that type of player.
But it's a bit simplistic to say he's a striker that doesn't score therefore he's shyte. The way we play currently he's a very important impact sub because he plays off defenders which causes space to open up as they come out to him when he's competing for the ball or in possession of the ball.
When Goodwin changes personnel late in games VDS is a big part of the chaos strategy that leads to our late goals.

Conway11 wrote:

Finn Seemann wrote:

Conway11 wrote:

Yes - we have a very limited way of playing that will catch up with us eventually, it is going great just now but IT WILL fizzle out. Recruitment in January is key, Gallagher is 33, Kevin Holt is 31 - we need to have someone waiting in the wings with top level experience to take us that extra step forward. I believe Cleal-Harding will come good and think he may dislodge Holt soon.

Babunski is being hung out to dry in this system - he is the most creative player at the club and is being shunted out from this position

JR is 34 but would be perfect foil for Dalby - would be reminiscent of a Daly-Goodwillie/Russell partnership, a short term spell while Stirton gets up to scratch would be ideal.  
 

Not sure I would agree with this.  We've solidified from the back with the 3 CHs (even with Graham missing) and wing backs approach.  Granted we'll need to find two longer term CHs to play alongside Graham as Gallagher and Holt are clearly at the wrong end if their careers.  However, having never been a particular fan of either, I have to concede that both are playing beyond themselves at the moment.  We therefore shouldn't be telling guys they're goners until we know we can replace them.

We've managed to slot Stephenson and Vicko into the Sibbald and Docherty holes.  That system is currently serving us well and allows Babunski a little bit of freedom (which to be fair he hasn't really excelled himself in) to express himself, but if the wing backs aren't pinned back (as they haven't been for a whole game yet) that doesn't matter quite as much.

Up front we are missing a bit of speed and that has to be the focus for the January window.  JR is not that man.  We need to see a bit more of the attacking play from the derby and a bit less route one (Dalby doesn't hold it up that well), but I can't say that I don't expect us to score in any game.  I do.  That is light years ahead of where we were with Tony Watt as first choice or option.  

I am generally fairly pessimistic when it comes to United, but I see no reason why things must fizzle out.  We've played everyone (bar Celtic) and bar a couple of halves against Aberdeen and Rangers and a 20 minute spell against Killie nobody has overrun us and even then (bar Killie) those spells haven't conceded too many goals.  We've also scored in most games (quite often more than one).  I suspect we'll get a doing from Celtic, but I think incremental changes are called for rather than wholesale changes.  We are also beginning to see Goodwin using the bench appropriately even with quite a few players still on the sick list.  

Goodwin has proved my suspicions about his abilities wrong this season.  As have the players.  We are playing as a team and they are meeting the challenges as they come.  Two big games v Killie and Motherwell coming up.  Taking 4 or more of the 6 points would be immense.  We can then shore up or have a go v Celtic - I don't mind.

I do like Findlay at Killie (although seems to have his inury issues this season). Armstrong would also make a bit of sense.

I see where you’re coming from, but I have to push back on a few of your points. Yes, the 3 CH system with wing-backs is working well for now, and I agree that Gallagher and Holt have been playing beyond expectations.

However, that is precisely why planning for their eventual decline—or injury—is so important. We’ve seen how quickly players in these positions can fall off, especially in a physically demanding setup like ours. Waiting until they’re no longer performing isn’t good enough. Recruitment in January is key to ensuring we don’t lose the momentum we’ve built this season.

You mention we shouldn’t be telling guys they’re "goners" until replacements are lined up, but I’m not advocating for binning them mid-season. Gallagher and Holt deserve credit for their performances, but we need to find top-level experience that can slot in when they can’t keep up. Depth and forward-thinking recruitment are non-negotiable if we want to sustain success.

On Babunski, you say he’s been given freedom, but I strongly disagree. This system is stifling him. He’s our most creative player, yet he’s being played in a way that doesn’t maximize his abilities. Yes, the wing-backs have done well so far, but what happens when they’re pinned back by better opposition or injuries? Babunski’s flair and vision should be the heartbeat of our attacking play, not a secondary option reliant on a system that prioritizes width over creativity.

As for the attack, I agree that speed is the glaring issue. But you dismiss JR too quickly. No, he’s not a long-term solution at 34, but his experience and ability to complement Dalby could be invaluable in the short term. It’s not just about pace; it’s about having a player who can make the runs and open space for others, which JR could do while Stirton continues to develop. It’s a short-term solution, yes, but one that makes a lot of sense given where we are now.

I’m glad to hear you’re optimistic about the team, but saying there’s no reason why things must fizzle out feels naive. We’re not invincible. Injuries, fatigue, and opposition figuring us out are all very real threats. You’ve pointed out a few tough spells against Aberdeen, Rangers, and Killie—and that’s only going to happen more often as teams adapt. Without speed up front and creativity from midfield, we risk becoming predictable and easier to nullify.I respect what Goodwin has done, and he’s definitely surprised a lot of people, but incremental changes alone won’t be enough if we’re serious about pushing on.

Celtic will be a reality check for where we really stand, but these next two games against Killie and Motherwell are where we must show we can adapt and take the next step forward. Taking 4+ points would be fantastic, but if we don’t address the areas where we’re already showing cracks, even that won’t matter in the long run.

We need clear plans to address the aging defense, lack of pace up front, and underutilized creativity in midfield. Without these, the solid foundation we’ve built could collapse sooner than you think.
 

 

Season has went all to pot since this post. People were seeing the signs in January? Why can’t the manager?

Jim had an article in the Courier midweek about the  Babunski situation.

Tek wrote:

Slotbadger wrote:

I can only assume Goodwin did see most of the issues described.

He signed 2 midfielders that are meant to be forward thinking. And another striker.

They all look like poor signings is the problem. Goodwin has a good record in summer transfer windows. Like just about every other manager, not so much January.

I don’t think it was his decision to sell Holt. But has been his decision to ditch Babunski for no apparent reason. I haven’t even seen a rumour about attitude. I don’t think he was even close to being as bad as some make out. The facts are pretty clear. He was subbed at half time V aberdeen at home when I thought he played well. We won that game. He hasn’t really played again. Our complete loss of form coincides almost perfectly with this. Not saying that is the only reason, but do think it’s part of it.

Goodwin was quoted two days ago praising Babunski's attitude, saying he 'sets the standards' at training etc.

His omission is just all the more bizarre.
 

 
When Campbell is getting starts in midfield after these terrible performances ahead of Babunski either we're not getting told the truth or there's something wrong with our manager.  It's either one or the other.

Slotbadger wrote:

redford_must_score wrote:

Tek wrote:

Goodwin was quoted two days ago praising Babunski's attitude, saying he 'sets the standards' at training etc.

His omission is just all the more bizarre.
 

 
When Campbell is getting starts in midfield after these terrible performances ahead of Babunski either we're not getting told the truth or there's something wrong with our manager. It's either one or the other.

 
All football fans and forums come up with rumours. Like Doc on the booze or butcher being a shagger. I haven’t seen any about Babunski except that he has never stayed at one club long and this hints at an attitude problem. Maybe.

I am generally pretty pro Goodwin, but given the lack of rumours and what TEK has noted above, it does suggest Goodwin believes Campbell and Fiorini are bringing more to the team than Babunski some how.

It could be that Goodwin sees Campbell as part of the plans next season, provided he gets up to scratch. With Babunski out of contract (as well as Campbell, of course) it might be the case of Campbell being in the plans and Babunski being exiled, so to speak. However, our position in the league must take precedence over such plans if it were the case.
 

Finn Seemann wrote:

Conway11 wrote:

Finn Seemann wrote:

Suspect we are not actually that far apart here.  I'm all for proactive recruitment, I'm just not sure we'll succeed in getting to many in in January.  I suspect we may go down the pre-contract route but that means replacements for the aging stars are not going to be in the building until the summer.

I like Babunski, but I'm not convinced that he has the engine to compliment his undoubted talent.  I am not sure that we will ever see his potential because he's actually not fit enough for this league.  So I stand by my view and unfortunately I think he'll also be away in the summer.

I'd be happy enough with JR coming in short term (and understand that is not out of the question) but still think we need pace first. Stirton is probably a couple of seasons off being a regular so we need someone else to tide us over and no guarantees Stirton makes it.

I don't agree on your view of big push v incremental changes.  Realistically the best we can do in the league is 3rd and we're currently 4th.  Now if some of the club's suitors end up bolstering the war chest, that becomes a different matter, but until someone has greased the Ogren palm there isn't going to be a big push.  That doesn't mean the team's progress must fizzle out.  Granted, I agree that we are probably in an over-inflated position but I just don't see enough clubs figuring us out to that extent and, in any case, I think Jim is still learning as he goes too.

But I actually don't wildly disagree with you - planning and proactivity is a must and I'm reasonably confident that is what is happening - just not with new bodies (bar a couple) in January.
 

Fair points, Finn, but I’m not sure waiting until the summer is wise. January doesn’t need to be a big overhaul, but just 1-2 key additions—especially in defense or midfield—could be the difference between 3rd and fading away. I for one cannot wait for Tony Watt to be off the books saving us £5k a week.

On Babunski, I get the concerns about his engine, but fitness is something we can improve. His creativity is something we lack elsewhere. If Goodwin can tweak the system to put him at the heart of our attacking play, we’d be much more dangerous.

Can't argue with that!

pity he never tweaked it.
 

Conway11 wrote:

redford_must_score wrote:

Conway11 wrote:

Moving players on who our out of contract - I would tell the following that they are not getting a new deal

Gallagher 
Moult
Holt
Docherty
Newman
Middleton

Would give Babunski another year - he would be great with a new manager in a proper system, played in his ideal position. 

The ones above are not good enough if we really do want to be a top 5 side. 

Would go for Stuart Findlay and Danny Armstrong (both OOC at Killie in the summer) to replace Gallagher and Middleton



 

 
Had to read that twice to check it wasn't a wind up.
New manager? Seriously?
Gallagher and Holt have been immense and one of the reasons we'vebeen so successful.
Agree we're not seeing the best of Babunski though and I agree why.
But results are everything and right now we are getting them.

Morning Redford - current thoughts? 

 
Nice trolling fella.

My thought are pretty much what everyone has said. I want my team to be winning just like everyone else. When Gallacher and Holt were playing together we looked far more solid, Gallacher looked far more solid.  Holt's departure has been the main thing that's done for us, then add in the loss of the underrated work that Stephenson brought and the squad starts to look very poor.
Telling Gallacher he wasn't getting a new deal was a shocking move.
When we are winning games I'm prepared to put Goodwin's lack of coaching ability to one side. When we are losing games and looking like a shambles I won't put it to one side. And I haven't. Read my posts.

Is that satisfactory for you?