JerryDungle wrote:

Would like a pacy striker, but other than that, think we’re pretty much sorted. Mostly just be outgoings I would think.

In saying that, I would happily hang off on signing another striker if it meant getting Johnny Russell back in January when his MLS contract expires. I’ve always wondered if Fotheringham would be better suited to playing up front. He lacks the real burst of pace needed to ever be a good premier ship winger, but his numbers in front of last season were really good, and all of his goals pretty much came from being in the right place positionally to get on the end of things rather than moments of brilliance. Surely that’s got to translate into him having a chance of being a halfway decent striker.

Johnny Russell ain't coming back. He's making mega bucks in the US and won't be short of admirers in the MLS. Also his family is all settled across there. Only time we would see him at Tannadice is if he was a pundit or came across to visit family in Scotland, and fancied a wee visit to watch us.

Pacey striker is needed. Expect to see Grimshaw leave on loan, a couple of young lads going out on loan and possibly Fotheringham going to Crawley.
 

JerryDungle wrote:

. I’ve always wondered if Fotheringham would be better suited to playing up front. He lacks the real burst of pace needed to ever be a good premier ship winger, but his numbers in front of last season were really good, and all of his goals pretty much came from being in the right place positionally to get on the end of things rather than moments of brilliance. Surely that’s got to translate into him having a chance of being a halfway decent striker.

I totally agree and that is exactly why i would keep him.

I would like to see if he could be converted into a decent penalty box Striker given time.
 

Arabdownsouth wrote:

Tek wrote:

JerryDungle wrote:

. I’ve always wondered if Fotheringham would be better suited to playing up front. He lacks the real burst of pace needed to ever be a good premier ship winger, but his numbers in front of last season were really good, and all of his goals pretty much came from being in the right place positionally to get on the end of things rather than moments of brilliance. Surely that’s got to translate into him having a chance of being a halfway decent striker.

I totally agree and that is exactly why i would keep him.

I would like to see if he could be converted into a decent penalty box Striker given time.
 

 
Said the same thing last week myself, although not sure if that was on here or on Mad.

 Possible  but I'm a we bit sceptical on that, he'd need to develop his physique. Not too many successful light strikers in the Scottish game. Right now I'm not seeing how he starts in the side, been a bit ineffective on the right. Probably needs loaned to a top end Championship side if there's interest.

JerryDungle wrote:

redford_must_score wrote:

Arabdownsouth wrote:

 
Said the same thing last week myself, although not sure if that was on here or on Mad.

 Possible  but I'm a we bit sceptical on that, he'd need to develop his physique. Not too many successful light strikers in the Scottish game. Right now I'm not seeing how he starts in the side, been a bit ineffective on the right. Probably needs loaned to a top end Championship side if there's interest.

 
I don’t see the point in loaning him out to the championship. He’s already proven he can cut it at that level. We need to see if he’s capable of cutting it at Dundee United in the Premiership, and I don’t think that’s gonna be as a winger. His physique and strength are things that can easily be worked on, having the ability to be in the right place at the right time is much harder to teach, and we know he has that, he’s definitely too talented to just chuck away, but I think we need to move him up front and see how he does there. If we were to do that I wouldn’t be too fussed if we don’t sign another striker at this moment in time.

 
By that token are you seriously suggesting that Kai starts ahead of Moult Trapanovski Van der Sand just to see if by some miracle he's better?
I get that players can be a revelation in a different position eg Heggie signed as a CF but this is a stretch. C'mon.

JerryDungle wrote:

redford_must_score wrote:

JerryDungle wrote:

 
I don’t see the point in loaning him out to the championship. He’s already proven he can cut it at that level. We need to see if he’s capable of cutting it at Dundee United in the Premiership, and I don’t think that’s gonna be as a winger. His physique and strength are things that can easily be worked on, having the ability to be in the right place at the right time is much harder to teach, and we know he has that, he’s definitely too talented to just chuck away, but I think we need to move him up front and see how he does there. If we were to do that I wouldn’t be too fussed if we don’t sign another striker at this moment in time.

 
By that token are you seriously suggesting that Kai starts ahead of Moult Trapanovski Van der Sand just to see if by some miracle he's better?
I get that players can be a revelation in a different position eg Heggie signed as a CF but this is a stretch. C'mon.

 
I’m saying he can be brought on in the last 20 mins of games to play off VDS to see how he does up there.

 
Fair enough JD it could work.
It was interesting that Goodwin at one point was touting  MT as a brilliant RB but after a few basic defensive errors eg getting caught wrong side, played him in the advanced role v Scumdee and he was a revelation there. So it can work.

RogerTheAlien wrote:

Odada must surely be fit now plus with Doch back it gives us strength in depth there. Surely Meshack is fit now too.

I’d be letting Middleton and Grimshaw away too. Probably Fotheringham as well.

Striker needed, preferably pacy.

Regarding Odada.

It's a chicken and egg thing, you can't get match fit without playing top level matches but you can't get a game if you look like you couldn't trap a bag of cement.

He reminds me of the very first minute I seen Henry Arnier, his second touch was a header. I hope I am wrong and hopefully he turns out to be a star but very much doubt it

Agree with Grimshaw, good team player but bottom half championship player imo.

Fotheringham I would keep, you can't coach what he has, great timing and usually in the right place at the right time. His time will come but he will just need to bide his time.

RogerTheAlien wrote:

Odada must surely be fit now plus with Doch back it gives us strength in depth there. Surely Meshack is fit now too.

I’d be letting Middleton and Grimshaw away too. Probably Fotheringham as well.

Striker needed, preferably pacy.

 
Saw Meshak in the wee derby as well, looked quite sharp definitely skilful, liked to cut in from the right but end product often not there, that sounds strangely familiar aye. But definitely fitter than Odada who never had a preseason I believe.
If Meshak is going to be first choice when we want to play an attacker in front of Stephenson not sure where that leaves Kai.

Sorry guys, but Kai just doesn't have at at this level, doesn't have the pace or trickery for a winger and certainly doesn't have the strength to be a striker, he'll drop down the leagues and hopefully have a decent career.

Shedtastic wrote:

As for Odada, called up again for his national team, guy must have something about him, let's give him a bit of time.

 
That call up is great for him but isn't helpful to us because he might not get minutes despite all the travelling, breaks his fitness regime up and misses minutes in B games or bounce games.

As to Kai, I'm a bit jury out. The Prem these days is a big step up week in week out from the Championship and I do have doubts that he can impact the first 11 regularly.

Understandably folk have a big sway bias? towards our youngsters like Kai, Miller T,  quite a few unhappy when Mochrie etc were released  but if they're not to the standard required we can't just keep them around. The new signings that have come into the side so far are a serious upgrade.

Stillliving wrote:

Canadian Arab wrote:

I'd be giving Kai as many minutes as possible playing centrally up top in whatever the reserve team / youth team is called these days, and have him on the bench for the first team and giving him minutes in that position when we can. I wouldn't even consider moving him on.

Our second top scorer last season in what was basically his debut season as a first team regular. Makes clever runs and finds good space when he does drift into the middle, so give him a chance there.

Luggy was no colossus, and he was up against defenders who were allowed to commit GBH several times before even getting a quiet word from the ref. And he did okay in and around the edge of the box!

Edit: Even if we do sign another striker this week, I doubt Moult will last at premier level beyond the end of the season. Kai might come good as the lad playing off the shoulder of VDS. Doesn't need electric pace over 40 yards - just a drop of the shoulder and enough to give himself half a yard on a defender.

 

C'mon now CA making comparisons between Sturrock & Fotheringham.  Luggy was a one off.
I've nothing against  Fotheringham but there are too many gaps In his game.

He could make a career in the Championship though as he has a level of ability.
We've kept ex academy players for too long  in the past. Freeman & Glass are two that spring to mind

 
Have to agree with Canadian Arab here I'm afraid, give the lad a chance. Did very well last season and fully deserves an opportunity at this level. Players are not going to be the complete package at his age.

Slotbadger wrote:

Shedtastic wrote:

Sorry guys, but Kai just doesn't have at at this level, doesn't have the pace or trickery for a winger and certainly doesn't have the strength to be a striker, he'll drop down the leagues and hopefully have a decent career.

 
Yeah. I just can’t believe some of our fans can have this opinion because it is not based on what he has done. In his first season of senior football he did very well, noticeably improved and
Contributed more than many established players who started the season ahead of him in the squad.

He hasn’t even started a game this season against an SPL team I don’t think, never mind been given a wee run in the team. I have no idea if he will continue to improve, but there are good signs he might.

The argument if they are good enough they will be played  I don’t think is accurate either. Fact is it is down to subjective manager’s opinion. I believe if successive managers in relegation season had played Newman and Graham ahead of poppadom and Mulgrew we would have been much closer to surviving. Young players need time and a run of games in the first team to get confidence up and learn before anyone can know if they will develop into a good player.

Having said that - if we could bank 500k + for Kai I would accept that.

 
Totally agree with this

Just no getting the Kai out thing. Having had a major purge Goodwin has hung on to Kai so you'd think Goodwin must rate him and bear in mind the laddie's an U21 international so he he's no mug.

Last year although he rarely set the heather on fire he was still what ? Second highest scorer ? Steady I thought.

Odada has had a run, even Meshack got a run. No Kai.

Would any potential Kai sale have a bearing on striker we need and would there be be any room for Kai once that deal goes through.

Glad it's Jim making decisions no me.

 

Last edited by Shakey Isles Arab (27/8/2024 11:00 pm)