Tekel Towers » Summer Transfer Window

Finn Seemann · 23/7/2021 5:22 pm

Another week goes by. Why is Tam the fall guy here, when all he has is the final say on a signings? What are the DoE and the head of recruitment saying? What are you thinking Tam 'Patsy' Courts?

Last edited by Finn Seemann (23/7/2021 5:22 pm)

Arabdownsouth · 23/7/2021 6:59 pm

Finn Seemann wrote:
Arabdownsouth wrote:
Tangy wrote:

In the statement the other day, he said he was giving time to the youngsters to prove their worth.....if only we had a bit of continuity with the new manager - maybe if he had worked with them before..... oh aye - he's been working with them for the last year and doesn't know if they can hack it at this level or not. Ideal tam, ideal.

He might have been working with them for the last year, but how on earth can he know if they can hack it at this level until he tries them at this level? It's not exactly rocket science is it?
Is the job of the Academy coach not to make sure that they are ready for the level and that they get promoted to the first team when they are? Of course there is always a question of will the cut it when they get there, but the Academy are supposed to be ensuring that those that make the grade do cut it. That's the point! The undercurrent of the comments are 'how would these guys know as none of them have themselves played or indeed been involved at that level'. If our Academy guys don't know what a 1st team regular looks like, what exactly are they training them for. Get your head back down that hole where it belongs...

That's all one big crock of shit and you know it. Last year people were wondering whether Lawrence Shankland would be good enough for the Premiership. The fact is you don't know until they are tested at that level.

SuperMario · 23/7/2021 8:37 pm

Anyone getting worried yet?

Beharder · 23/7/2021 8:48 pm

SuperMario wrote:
Anyone getting worried yet?

No
I'm completely unflappable

Shakey Isles Arab · 23/7/2021 10:06 pm

Beharder wrote:
SuperMario wrote:
Anyone getting worried yet?

No
I'm completely unflappable

Love it !

Finn Seemann · 23/7/2021 11:27 pm

Arabdownsouth wrote:
Finn Seemann wrote:
Arabdownsouth wrote:

He might have been working with them for the last year, but how on earth can he know if they can hack it at this level until he tries them at this level? It's not exactly rocket science is it?
Is the job of the Academy coach not to make sure that they are ready for the level and that they get promoted to the first team when they are? Of course there is always a question of will the cut it when they get there, but the Academy are supposed to be ensuring that those that make the grade do cut it. That's the point! The undercurrent of the comments are 'how would these guys know as none of them have themselves played or indeed been involved at that level'. If our Academy guys don't know what a 1st team regular looks like, what exactly are they training them for. Get your head back down that hole where it belongs...

That's all one big crock of shit and you know it. Last year people were wondering whether Lawrence Shankland would be good enough for the Premiership. The fact is you don't know until they are tested at that level.

Keep going sir. I admitted that you ultimately don't know until they are tested . But to suggest that boys who actually earn a living from us training these guys can't tell whether a boy is the real deal or not is nonsense unless they actually shouldn't be in that role. I have seen 3 or 4 boys in my young lads age group (2007) who are destined to make it. So I'm trusting that a boy who is actually getting paid for the job can figure out who is a mid table prem league player or not. Otherwise, what are they doing? Are you actually for real?

Arabdownsouth · 24/7/2021 6:53 am

Finn Seemann wrote:
Arabdownsouth wrote:
Finn Seemann wrote:

Is the job of the Academy coach not to make sure that they are ready for the level and that they get promoted to the first team when they are? Of course there is always a question of will the cut it when they get there, but the Academy are supposed to be ensuring that those that make the grade do cut it. That's the point! The undercurrent of the comments are 'how would these guys know as none of them have themselves played or indeed been involved at that level'. If our Academy guys don't know what a 1st team regular looks like, what exactly are they training them for. Get your head back down that hole where it belongs...

That's all one big crock of shit and you know it. Last year people were wondering whether Lawrence Shankland would be good enough for the Premiership. The fact is you don't know until they are tested at that level.
Keep going sir. I admitted that you ultimately don't know until they are tested . But to suggest that boys who actually earn a living from us training these guys can't tell whether a boy is the real deal or not is nonsense unless they actually shouldn't be in that role. I have seen 3 or 4 boys in my young lads age group (2007) who are destined to make it. So I'm trusting that a boy who is actually getting paid for the job can figure out who is a mid table prem league player or not. Otherwise, what are they doing? Are you actually for real?

I still disagree that he ought to know if these kids will make it in the Premiership. Most of our squad have played at Premiership level for the last year, but no cunt can work out if they are good enough or not 😂

I'm happy to agree to disagree though 👍

BMT · 24/7/2021 7:38 am

SuperMario wrote:
Anyone getting worried yet?

I'm not getting worried but getting as though I couldn't care which is worse as I'm fed up with not even being linked to anyone and accepting we will start the season with the squad we have.

MockChop · 24/7/2021 1:37 pm

I’d kill for a fucking rumour at least.

arabchanter · 24/7/2021 2:54 pm

MockChop wrote:
I’d kill for a fucking rumour at least.

Get yourself over to mad, "Funboat" aka "shedboy__21" now using "deebuster" to back himself up as the latter got banned, is full of it, obviously FACTS as he's the font of all knowledge! The boy's a total fantasist, feel sorry for him to be honest!

Finn Seemann · 25/7/2021 9:41 am

Arabdownsouth wrote:
Finn Seemann wrote:
Arabdownsouth wrote:

That's all one big crock of shit and you know it. Last year people were wondering whether Lawrence Shankland would be good enough for the Premiership. The fact is you don't know until they are tested at that level.
Keep going sir. I admitted that you ultimately don't know until they are tested . But to suggest that boys who actually earn a living from us training these guys can't tell whether a boy is the real deal or not is nonsense unless they actually shouldn't be in that role. I have seen 3 or 4 boys in my young lads age group (2007) who are destined to make it. So I'm trusting that a boy who is actually getting paid for the job can figure out who is a mid table prem league player or not. Otherwise, what are they doing? Are you actually for real?

I still disagree that he ought to know if these kids will make it in the Premiership. Most of our squad have played at Premiership level for the last year, but no cunt can work out if they are good enough or not 😂

I'm happy to agree to disagree though 👍

I think we are talking about 2 different things here. I'm not suggesting that these guys should know that a young lad is going to have a wonderful career in the Premiership. Just that they are going to be good enough to challenge for a place in our team. That has to be a prerequisite for the job surely.

Arabdownsouth · 25/7/2021 10:19 am

Finn Seemann wrote:
Arabdownsouth wrote:
Finn Seemann wrote:

Keep going sir. I admitted that you ultimately don't know until they are tested . But to suggest that boys who actually earn a living from us training these guys can't tell whether a boy is the real deal or not is nonsense unless they actually shouldn't be in that role. I have seen 3 or 4 boys in my young lads age group (2007) who are destined to make it. So I'm trusting that a boy who is actually getting paid for the job can figure out who is a mid table prem league player or not. Otherwise, what are they doing? Are you actually for real?

I still disagree that he ought to know if these kids will make it in the Premiership. Most of our squad have played at Premiership level for the last year, but no cunt can work out if they are good enough or not 😂

I'm happy to agree to disagree though 👍
I think we are talking about 2 different things here. I'm not suggesting that these guys should know that a young lad is going to have a wonderful career in the Premiership. Just that they are going to be good enough to challenge for a place in our team. That has to be a prerequisite for the job surely.

In all honesty all of this is probably not worth the debate I'm pretty sure Courts will know everything about these young players, he will still want to see how they cope though. I think too much is being read into every comment that he makes to the press, and I'm pretty sure we will be making signings at some point to complement the squad. Fwiw, it can't be an easy situation for the manager when he won't know whether or not he's going to be without Shankland or Benji or both even come the end of the window. These are the players he will be hoping to build his team around and trying to sign the right players to complete the squad will not be as straightforward as some think. I say cut him some slack and let him do his job and keep the faith. FTD!

Lilley01 · 26/7/2021 12:06 pm

Our lack of signings in certain positions seems to be more like a policy of identify and sign or don't sign at all. You often here about certain clubs having to go right down their list of signing targets for a position as they couldn't get the others. We seem to have 1 or 2 and if we don't get them then that's that, we go with what we have.

Whether there was truth in the Swedish and Finnish players or not, we're no closer to signing a wide player a year later. can be very frustrating but clubs our size, in our situation can't afford too many Alex Nicholls'. There's a lot of sense in that approach and not falling into the same traps football clubs perennially fall into. It's probably approaches like this that our current management team have done well (to balance up the regular accusations of things they do badly).

On quantity over quality - Fans were happy when we signed Adam Barton but no one needs to carry the can or pay the cost of those initial feelings within a fan base (directly).

Lancashire-Arab · 26/7/2021 12:40 pm

The worry is that we get to the end of the transfer window and make some desperation signings or bring in loan signings that add nothing to the team

Finn Seemann · 26/7/2021 1:06 pm

Lilley01 wrote:
Our lack of signings in certain positions seems to be more like a policy of identify and sign or don't sign at all. You often here about certain clubs having to go right down their list of signing targets for a position as they couldn't get the others. We seem to have 1 or 2 and if we don't get them then that's that, we go with what we have.

Whether there was truth in the Swedish and Finnish players or not, we're no closer to signing a wide player a year later. can be very frustrating but clubs our size, in our situation can't afford too many Alex Nicholls'. There's a lot of sense in that approach and not falling into the same traps football clubs perennially fall into. It's probably approaches like this that our current management team have done well (to balance up the regular accusations of things they do badly).

On quantity over quality - Fans were happy when we signed Adam Barton but no one needs to carry the can or pay the cost of those initial feelings within a fan base (directly).

The current bunch failing to sign anybody can't really be excused by the fact that their predecessors signed a barrel load of shit. We have some positions that need to be bolstered and we have known that for years. Whilst Tam says 'we might not get the players we want but we will get the players we need' I assume that means we might not get our first choice but we will get someone. Unless he thinks we don't need anyone - in which case we may as well call it quits now.

Lilley01 · 26/7/2021 1:43 pm

Finn Seemann wrote:
Lilley01 wrote:
Our lack of signings in certain positions seems to be more like a policy of identify and sign or don't sign at all. You often here about certain clubs having to go right down their list of signing targets for a position as they couldn't get the others. We seem to have 1 or 2 and if we don't get them then that's that, we go with what we have.

Whether there was truth in the Swedish and Finnish players or not, we're no closer to signing a wide player a year later. can be very frustrating but clubs our size, in our situation can't afford too many Alex Nicholls'. There's a lot of sense in that approach and not falling into the same traps football clubs perennially fall into. It's probably approaches like this that our current management team have done well (to balance up the regular accusations of things they do badly).

On quantity over quality - Fans were happy when we signed Adam Barton but no one needs to carry the can or pay the cost of those initial feelings within a fan base (directly).
The current bunch failing to sign anybody can't really be excused by the fact that their predecessors signed a barrel load of shit. We have some positions that need to be bolstered and we have known that for years. Whilst Tam says 'we might not get the players we want but we will get the players we need' I assume that means we might not get our first choice but we will get someone. Unless he thinks we don't need anyone - in which case we may as well call it quits now.

If you're a glass half-empty type with the knives already out then they can't. However, if you broaden your thinking and consider that recruitment is tougher now than the past 5+ years, I'd say they can be excused (to a point. i would love to see more width, pace, power and skill added).

The budget is tighter now than at any point recently due to Covid. Despite that, fans are desperate for signings which increases pressure to get players in - maybe the wrong ones. We're now promoted so the competition is tougher. therefore the bar for signing needs to be higher meaning less available players to sign. We're promoting youth, therefore the players need to be adding something to the starting XI or they just block a path.

If we're showing restraint for the right long term reasons, that's a good thing. Only to a point though. this squad needs help and balanced up.

Finn Seemann · 26/7/2021 4:44 pm

Lilley01 wrote:
Finn Seemann wrote:
Lilley01 wrote:
Our lack of signings in certain positions seems to be more like a policy of identify and sign or don't sign at all. You often here about certain clubs having to go right down their list of signing targets for a position as they couldn't get the others. We seem to have 1 or 2 and if we don't get them then that's that, we go with what we have.

Whether there was truth in the Swedish and Finnish players or not, we're no closer to signing a wide player a year later. can be very frustrating but clubs our size, in our situation can't afford too many Alex Nicholls'. There's a lot of sense in that approach and not falling into the same traps football clubs perennially fall into. It's probably approaches like this that our current management team have done well (to balance up the regular accusations of things they do badly).

On quantity over quality - Fans were happy when we signed Adam Barton but no one needs to carry the can or pay the cost of those initial feelings within a fan base (directly).
The current bunch failing to sign anybody can't really be excused by the fact that their predecessors signed a barrel load of shit. We have some positions that need to be bolstered and we have known that for years. Whilst Tam says 'we might not get the players we want but we will get the players we need' I assume that means we might not get our first choice but we will get someone. Unless he thinks we don't need anyone - in which case we may as well call it quits now.
If you're a glass half-empty type with the knives already out then they can't. However, if you broaden your thinking and consider that recruitment is tougher now than the past 5+ years, I'd say they can be excused (to a point. i would love to see more width, pace, power and skill added).

The budget is tighter now than at any point recently due to Covid. Despite that, fans are desperate for signings which increases pressure to get players in - maybe the wrong ones. We're now promoted so the competition is tougher. therefore the bar for signing needs to be higher meaning less available players to sign. We're promoting youth, therefore the players need to be adding something to the starting XI or they just block a path.

If we're showing restraint for the right long term reasons, that's a good thing. Only to a point though. this squad needs help and balanced up.

I'd actually just prefer that the club told us fans the truth. If we are strapped and need to make do with what we've got I'd rather that we collectively recalibrated our expectations and went into the season thinking premiership status is to be celebrated. As long as there was a plan for the future.

But no, we are told that top six is the target and that there will be signings despite everything else pointing to us being skint.

As I have said before, the Asghar Project is at a precipice and we've got one foot dangling over the edge.

SuperMario · 26/7/2021 5:04 pm

Kai fotheringham away to raith confirmed, we must be close to a signing

Do we have one fit winger and 2 fit strikers at the club at present??? Chalmers, shankland and Clark

Lilley01 · 26/7/2021 5:47 pm

There is no benefit to the selling club model to say we’re skint so we wont. Any fan with half a brain can read between the lines that we had to reduce the wage bill or at least spend it more wisely.

The top 6 target is based on building in last year which we o ly missed out by a point. Hardly unreasonable to expect an improvement from our now more experienced squad. Or should the players also say they think they’re shite and we have no chance? Honestly, try to be even a bit rational.

As for one foot dangling over the precipice…. The “project” got us promotion, safety and a point away from top 6. Fuck knows what you call the 3 years that preceded that because we’ve only went one way.

Things can get so much better but if you base your conclusions on facts and not opinions there’s just no way anyone can be as negative.

On KF, good move. Always like to see players go to championship rather than further down.

Finn Seemann · 26/7/2021 6:07 pm

Lilley01 wrote:
There is no benefit to the selling club model to say we’re skint so we wont. Any fan with half a brain can read between the lines that we had to reduce the wage bill or at least spend it more wisely.

The top 6 target is based on building in last year which we o ly missed out by a point. Hardly unreasonable to expect an improvement from our now more experienced squad. Or should the players also say they think they’re shite and we have no chance? Honestly, try to be even a bit rational.

As for one foot dangling over the precipice…. The “project” got us promotion, safety and a point away from top 6. Fuck knows what you call the 3 years that preceded that because we’ve only went one way.

Things can get so much better but if you base your conclusions on facts and not opinions there’s just no way anyone can be as negative.

On KF, good move. Always like to see players go to championship rather than further down.

Fair enough that we wouldn't really want to broadcast being skint, but everybody knows that anyway so I am not so sure it makes that much difference.

On the squad, granted that those who remain have a premiership season behind them now, but I don't think the squad can be considered stronger. Mulgrew adds some experience (albeit in a position we probably didn't need it) but we have lost players that do weaken us (McNulty) and we've also thinned out some of the experienced back up and backfilled with kids. That coupled with the fact that Hearts and Dundee look stronger than Killie and Hamilton and others around us have actually strengthened, means for me that top six is unlikely albeit I can see that our supposed upwards trajectory demands it. I don't think we are going to battle out dull draws and narrow wins as we did last year, albeit it seems that the league cup group performances might suggest otherwise.

As I have said, the money got us promotion (a season later than it should have) and a decent experienced (but boring as feck to watch) manager who clearly wasn't signed up to the Project kept us in the league. The Project is only starting for real now. Achievements are of course facts (and we didn't achieve anything in the three seasons pre-Asghar), but what is going on at the club is also a fact and plain to see. I take from that bad times ahead. I may be wrong - I hope I am.

I also don't see that letting a kid go out on loan is going to free up any material cash that would make way for a signing of any relevance. I think it is the right thing to do though for the kid's career.

I don't think I have been less excited/more apprehensive for a start of a season in the 43 years I've been following the club.

Beharder · 26/7/2021 6:14 pm

Finn Seemann wrote:
Lilley01 wrote:
There is no benefit to the selling club model to say we’re skint so we wont. Any fan with half a brain can read between the lines that we had to reduce the wage bill or at least spend it more wisely.

The top 6 target is based on building in last year which we o ly missed out by a point. Hardly unreasonable to expect an improvement from our now more experienced squad. Or should the players also say they think they’re shite and we have no chance? Honestly, try to be even a bit rational.

As for one foot dangling over the precipice…. The “project” got us promotion, safety and a point away from top 6. Fuck knows what you call the 3 years that preceded that because we’ve only went one way.

Things can get so much better but if you base your conclusions on facts and not opinions there’s just no way anyone can be as negative.

On KF, good move. Always like to see players go to championship rather than further down.
Fair enough that we wouldn't really want to broadcast being skint, but everybody knows that anyway so I am not so sure it makes that much difference.

On the squad, granted that those who remain have a premiership season behind them now, but I don't think the squad can be considered stronger. Mulgrew adds some experience (albeit in a position we probably didn't need it) but we have lost players that do weaken us (McNulty) and we've also thinned out some of the experienced back up and backfilled with kids. That coupled with the fact that Hearts and Dundee look stronger than Killie and Hamilton and others around us have actually strengthened, means for me that top six is unlikely albeit I can see that our supposed upwards trajectory demands it. I don't think we are going to battle out dull draws and narrow wins as we did last year, albeit it seems that the league cup group performances might suggest otherwise.

As I have said, the money got us promotion (a season later than it should have) and a decent experienced (but boring as feck to watch) manager who clearly wasn't signed up to the Project kept us in the league. The Project is only starting for real now. Achievements are of course facts (and we didn't achieve anything in the three seasons pre-Asghar), but what is going on at the club is also a fact and plain to see. I take from that bad times ahead. I may be wrong - I hope I am.

I also don't see that letting a kid go out on loan is going to free up any material cash that would make way for a signing of any relevance. I think it is the right thing to do though for the kid's career.

I don't think I have been less excited/more apprehensive for a start of a season in the 43 years I've been following the club.

Were you more excited when we got played of the park by Dunfermilne at home) on the
opening day of season 2018/19?
We are in a far better position now

Finn Seemann · 26/7/2021 7:19 pm

Beharder wrote:
Finn Seemann wrote:
Lilley01 wrote:
There is no benefit to the selling club model to say we’re skint so we wont. Any fan with half a brain can read between the lines that we had to reduce the wage bill or at least spend it more wisely.

The top 6 target is based on building in last year which we o ly missed out by a point. Hardly unreasonable to expect an improvement from our now more experienced squad. Or should the players also say they think they’re shite and we have no chance? Honestly, try to be even a bit rational.

As for one foot dangling over the precipice…. The “project” got us promotion, safety and a point away from top 6. Fuck knows what you call the 3 years that preceded that because we’ve only went one way.

Things can get so much better but if you base your conclusions on facts and not opinions there’s just no way anyone can be as negative.

On KF, good move. Always like to see players go to championship rather than further down.
Fair enough that we wouldn't really want to broadcast being skint, but everybody knows that anyway so I am not so sure it makes that much difference.

On the squad, granted that those who remain have a premiership season behind them now, but I don't think the squad can be considered stronger. Mulgrew adds some experience (albeit in a position we probably didn't need it) but we have lost players that do weaken us (McNulty) and we've also thinned out some of the experienced back up and backfilled with kids. That coupled with the fact that Hearts and Dundee look stronger than Killie and Hamilton and others around us have actually strengthened, means for me that top six is unlikely albeit I can see that our supposed upwards trajectory demands it. I don't think we are going to battle out dull draws and narrow wins as we did last year, albeit it seems that the league cup group performances might suggest otherwise.

As I have said, the money got us promotion (a season later than it should have) and a decent experienced (but boring as feck to watch) manager who clearly wasn't signed up to the Project kept us in the league. The Project is only starting for real now. Achievements are of course facts (and we didn't achieve anything in the three seasons pre-Asghar), but what is going on at the club is also a fact and plain to see. I take from that bad times ahead. I may be wrong - I hope I am.

I also don't see that letting a kid go out on loan is going to free up any material cash that would make way for a signing of any relevance. I think it is the right thing to do though for the kid's career.

I don't think I have been less excited/more apprehensive for a start of a season in the 43 years I've been following the club.
Were you more excited when we got played of the park by Dunfermilne at home) on the
opening day of season 2018/19?
We are in a far better position now

We are in a better league position now, but no I was more excited before the start of that season as I was expecting us to be promoted and be winning most of our games. We nearly and should have managed that.

Strangely I think we are in a worse financial position now.

Tek · 26/7/2021 8:56 pm

Back on topic

Supposedly close to signing Congolese centre mid Beni Baningemi from Everton.

22 years old. Spent last season on loan at Derby.

Not a creative midfielder from what Everton fans are saying. More a ball winner, keeps things simple.

So, what Jack Doyle Hayes was meant to be.

Snacks94 · 26/7/2021 9:16 pm

Seen some random had tweeted about Everton boy on Twitter, any other source apart from that?

Snacks94 · 26/7/2021 9:51 pm

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/everton-transfer-state-of-play-21111171.amp

Bottom of this article mentions a Scottish club interested in the player, so suppose it could be us…