The most winnable cup, and yet again we treat it like bounce games/pre-season friendlies.

Yes, stats will say we're massively unlikely to win it, but ffs make sure you're at least in the fucking hat.

A few positions needing addressed, and a player willing to take a dip from 20+ yards would be nice.
 

Feel like there’s a still a lot of movement in this squad to be done. Watt Middleton Grimshaw have obviously been told there binned, were badly needing a number 9, a RWB , a centre half and most importantly a defensive midfielder- fuchs get on the blower to him

Never watched tonight but, I honestly feel we are 3 or 4 away from having a decent team for the prem, however Goodwin built a decent team with Aberdeen but couldn’t get a tune out of them, jury is still out on him.

Wonder if he will still be here in jan 🤔

Fucking shambles,Goodwin is clueless.  Too fucking annoyed to comment further tbh.

Last edited by Arabdownsouth (23/7/2024 10:08 pm)

Snacks94 wrote:

Four centre backs in our line up and we concede 2 goals from corners.

And this is a massive worry for me as to the recruitment side of things going forward.

Five of our seven signings thus far are defensive players.

It's now looking like he will make at least another 3 defensive signings (RWB, CH, DCM).

How far does the budget stretch? Not far i'd imagine. Meanwhile we are also desperate for a RW, and not one but TWO Strikers. One has to have pace (a real lack of pace throughout the team). As Moult has been very poor all pre-season and Watt looks finished. MacLeod also imminently leaving.

I fear him hanging his coat on this formation is leaving the recruitment lopsided once again.

Not looking forward to the Derby one bit.
 

It's all very Private Fraser on here. A few below par performances so far no doubt.
However it's still July the league hasn't even started but we're going down, sack Goodwin. There appears to be a panic about losing the Derby, we've lost many derbies before and we will lose more in the future. Stay calm.

10th for me would be an acceptable season  in the first year back in the top league

Stillliving wrote:

It's all very Private Fraser on here. A few below par performances so far no doubt.
However it's still July the league hasn't even started but we're going down, sack Goodwin. There appears to be a panic about losing the Derby, we've lost many derbies before and we will lose more in the future. Stay calm.

10th for me would be an acceptable season  in the first year back in the top league

 
If you want to sit back and accept mediocrity that's fine,some of us don't though.

Arabdownsouth wrote:

Stillliving wrote:

It's all very Private Fraser on here. A few below par performances so far no doubt.
However it's still July the league hasn't even started but we're going down, sack Goodwin. There appears to be a panic about losing the Derby, we've lost many derbies before and we will lose more in the future. Stay calm.

10th for me would be an acceptable season  in the first year back in the top league

 
If you want to sit back and accept mediocrity that's fine,some of us don't though.

 
It's not about acceptance it's about positivity.
It's easy to be glass half empty about life but I prefer to be glass half full.
It makes for a happier day.

Stillliving wrote:

It's all very Private Fraser on here. A few below par performances so far no doubt.
However it's still July the league hasn't even started but we're going down, sack Goodwin. There appears to be a panic about losing the Derby, we've lost many derbies before and we will lose more in the future. Stay calm.

10th for me would be an acceptable season in the first year back in the top league

10th totally unacceptable.
We are Dundee United
10th realistic - that's another matter.
 

Last edited by Shakey Isles Arab (24/7/2024 8:07 am)

I'd be delighted to finish tenth as long as we are building something.  I just don't see what style Goodwin is attempting to have us play.  I think formation is the only strategy that he thinks he needs.  That might be fine if we have good players, but we don't.  The goal from open play conceded last night just shouldn't have been conceded by a decent defence and even although the pitch was poor, we didn't look like a team who could competently pass the ball...!

I'm very concerned about midfield.  I think the Macedonians look good going forward but the engine room is not there.  I like Sibbald, but truth is he is a good Championship player but an average top league player.  I don't get the love-in for Docherty.  For a start he's not reliable enough and that is the biggest concern, but he hasn't been tested week in week out against top league players.  I don't think he'll cope.

The defence is a shambles.  Ferry looks a player, but I worry he has the positional sense of a Behich (i.e. doesn't defend as well as going forward).  For me Gallagher is finished at this level.  He wasn't any good last year.  Holt is a Championship player at best. Graham is a decent player but needs a better player alongside him and I don't think putting three sub-par CHs on the park is going to wash in the top league.  It's got Keystone Cops all over it.

Moult is finished at this level.  He just doesn't have the acceleration to make a difference.  He probably thinks a good game, but the mind is unfortunately now several steps ahead of the body.  Watt has always been shit and Middleton just seems to have lost anything he had before.  I like the look of Forbes, but the laddie isn't going to be a starter next season.  Fotheringham and Thomson are going to need pitch time to improve but don't think they are going to get that much.  

All that said, I have to commend the management for realising that we needed a total refresh.  If we are bringing in a striker and another next week and if we can bring in another couple if we move on Watt, Middleton and Grimshaw then we just might achieve survival or even better.  I still don't think Goodwin is the man to build us back.  My fear, as someone said before, is that he has built a team that isn't at all bad, but that he can't get a tune out of them.

Whilst the Derby isn't the be all and end all, a comfortable win for the Dees is going to put all the pressure on what is far from a cohesive unit.

 

Tangy wrote:

Arabdownsouth wrote:

Stillliving wrote:

It's all very Private Fraser on here. A few below par performances so far no doubt.
However it's still July the league hasn't even started but we're going down, sack Goodwin. There appears to be a panic about losing the Derby, we've lost many derbies before and we will lose more in the future. Stay calm.

10th for me would be an acceptable season in the first year back in the top league

 
If you want to sit back and accept mediocrity that's fine,some of us don't though.

I'm not having a go at you specifically but this phrase boils my piss. Jim is by far one of the finest scottish managers of all time and what he did for our club is probably the biggest input from any individual in the past or going forward. However, jim was manager in a very different time. Jim was also, if you listen to stories from those around him, a tortured soul. He wouldn't be a manager in this day and age (it's another discussion as to whether the current generation of footballers are spoiled/too soft etc)

United are where they are. Football is different. Money talks and no matter how much we want the team to win every game - it's not going to happen. It's not going to be lack of effort. It'll be from lack of money. Straight off the bat, we have lower home gates than rangers celtic aberd een hearts and hibs. So, in reality, we have the 6th biggest crowd to give us sales at the shop, tickets, hospitality etc. Then consider dundee, killie, motherwell etc have all played in the Premier last season...so have prize money way in advance of ours. That's a long way of saying our budget is likely 10th or 11th in the league and we are still transitioning out of some big contracts (watt, middleton) who don't offer value for money.

I think we have to be realistic in our expectations for the season. If we get this upset after a win, there's going to be no joy in it for us this season....

Am I delighted with last night? Absolutely not. Am I upset? Equally no
 

I agree we need to be realistic with expectations.  I realistically thought we'd get out of a group with Ayr and Falkirk.  Failing to do so does upset me, especially when I am not convinced that the manager knows how to get the best out of a group and ensure that we win important games against lesser opposition.  Realism also says that 10th come May would be a success and realistically with the budget we have somewhere between 6th and 10th should be possible.  Dundee are where they are because their manager knows what he is doing...

I'm waiting to see how we deal with the other teams in the Premiership before passing judgement.

We all knew that this tournament appeared to be treated with a bit of contempt last season, so why would we think it would be treated any other way this season?  I don't agree with that, for the record.

I'm disappointed with the loss to Falkirk and more so that we managed to lose a couple of goals to Buckie.

I think too many players have been given the benefit of the doubt when assessing their suitability for the top league, but I hope those players prove me wrong.  Some parts of the team are not up to the required standard, IMO, but they might just start to perform when it matters (he says optimistically).

Tangy wrote:

Arabdownsouth wrote:

Stillliving wrote:

It's all very Private Fraser on here. A few below par performances so far no doubt.
However it's still July the league hasn't even started but we're going down, sack Goodwin. There appears to be a panic about losing the Derby, we've lost many derbies before and we will lose more in the future. Stay calm.

10th for me would be an acceptable season  in the first year back in the top league

 
If you want to sit back and accept mediocrity that's fine,some of us don't though.

I'm not having a go at you specifically but this phrase boils my piss. Jim is by far one of the finest scottish managers of all time and what he did for our club is probably the biggest input from any individual in the past or going forward. However, jim was manager in a very different time. Jim was also, if you listen to stories from those around him, a tortured soul. He wouldn't be a manager in this day and age (it's another discussion as to whether  the current generation of footballers are spoiled/too soft etc)

United are where they are. Football is different. Money talks and no matter how much we want the team to win every game - it's not going to happen. It's not going to be lack of effort. It'll be from lack of money. Straight off the bat, we have lower home gates than rangers celtic aberd een hearts and hibs. So, in reality, we have the 6th biggest crowd to give us sales at the shop, tickets, hospitality etc. Then consider dundee, killie, motherwell etc have all played in the Premier last season...so have prize money way in advance of ours. That's a long way of saying our budget is likely 10th or 11th in the league and we are still transitioning out of some big contracts (watt, middleton) who don't offer value for money.

I think we have to be realistic in our expectations for the season. If we get this upset after a win, there's going to be no joy in it for us this season....

Am I delighted with last night? Absolutely not. Am I upset? Equally no
 

 
I didn't bring Jim into anything, so I'm confused by that really. I'm using my own words. Last night we were playing a virtual pub team and were way way short of good enough in my opinion. Yes the new signings look an improvement generally, but we still have a manager who really can't get a tune out of his squad,and we are now about to pumped out of another cup at the first hurdle under him. Each to their own of course,but im not happy to accept those kind of performances.