PatReilly wrote:

I think the disagreement between annanarab and Ex-Houston is more whether you call corners 'good long balls, punts or crosses' as Annan would state, or the EHA position that corners are 'set pieces'.

I'd tend to side with Ex-Houston Arab on this. 

I'm also more than happy that we appear to have become a threat from set pieces this season.



 

 
Pat,
I'm delighted we have become more of a threat from set pieces.
Scoring from corners is a massive plus and I used to complain that we never did.
I think our only one last season was durnan v Kilmarnock when we one 5-1.
It's not so much a disagreement other than I'm stating fact. Opta stats, pundits, managers, coaches and players categorise corners as set pieces as that's what they are.
I'm still interested to hear how our goal against Falkirk came from a cross, but even more interested to find out how our league winning team relied on long balls and crosses into the box.
On tek's point, ofere would be a good shout. He played well with Murray and this league does need bruisers. That's my main point -  I love a good headed goal from a cross. Ibrahimovic against Southampton springs to mind. I was just stating we don't currently have the personnel to do it unless it's a corner and the big men are up or it is absolutely pinpoint.
Tope is struggling and cammy smith is the much better option.
The downfall with Murray is he has no brains. That shot with his weaker foot when he should have rolled it to smith was unforgivable. He does that and we win that game 3-0. As we see, goal difference is important in a two horse race.
Pressure is on hibs now, let's hope they crack

Durnan scored from driving through the middle and passed to fraser. Cammy smith attempted a shot and it rebounded and he stuck it in. Fraser hit a low ball into the box to smiths feet.
It's not a misrepresentation.
You said we scored 8goals from 9 through crosses - I've laid them out to you and how they were scored.
Unless you counted corners as crosses that statement was incorrect.
I don't have any need to misrepresent you as I don't know you.
I took exception to something you stated as fact when it wasn't.
Don't get your point about short corners either.

Agree with EHA about Durnan's goal v Falkirk. Smith was blocked after receiving from Fraser and the ball broke to MD

Footage of the lad with 1 leg scoring at halftime. ...

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=_kXCFHdAgtw

you could see how frustrating the game was last night but as most I'm just buzzing with the 3 points, could be massive with hibs going to Falkirk hopefully a tough game for them. Dunfermline clearly done their homework on us fair play to them, they doubled up on Fraser every time he got the ball and they squeezed Andrue out the game for the most part (our 2 biggest players) and we seemed bereft of ideas without those 2 firing, thankfully Murray popped up with a poachers finish and the run continues. Agree again with the majority that Tope needs a long spell on the bench, offers nothing and fed up watching him trying stupid tricks and falling over.

annanarab wrote:

Ex Houston Arab wrote:

Durnan scored from driving through the middle and passed to fraser. Cammy smith attempted a shot and it rebounded and he stuck it in. Fraser hit a low ball into the box to smiths feet.
It's not a misrepresentation.
You said we scored 8goals from 9 through crosses - I've laid them out to you and how they were scored.
Unless you counted corners as crosses that statement was incorrect.
I don't have any need to misrepresent you as I don't know you.
I took exception to something you stated as fact when it wasn't.
Don't get your point about short corners either.

Not that anyone will care but your 1st words above have misrepresented me again.I stand by what I said. I do count corners or free kick as crosses providing they are crossed into the box as opposed to playing short and ending up in the midfield. Fraser was wide right (touchline) when he received the pass from Smith. He advanced down the line and crossed to Cammy Smith whose attempt was blocked before Durnan rammed the ball home. I just want to see more wide play and crosses cos I think this will produce more goals  
 

 
Post 31 you say you don't have a problem classing corners as set pieces.
Post 37 you say you are classing them as crosses.
Can you see where I'm struggling?
everyone else classes them separately. I've explained why.
Even if they were given as crosses(which they aren't), your 8 from 9 statement is still wrong.
I'm not really getting any traction here, and don't want to come across as labouring the point so I'll leave it there. Don't take things so personal, I'm not trying to misrepresent you - just a disagreement.
.

In case any out there has not yet died from boredom my analysis in respect of the 8/9 actually its 9/9

Crosses from open play
Morton      (h)(L)  cross wide right from Obadeyi - Andreu scored
Stranraer   (a)(IB)cross wide left Dixon - Andreu scored
St Mirren   (a)(L)  cross wide right Obadeyi - Fraser scored
Falkirk      (h) (L) cross wide right Fraser - Durnan scored

Crosses from set plays
Hibs         (a)(L)  corner left crossed by Fraser - Edjenguele scored
Dumbarton(h)(L)  corner right crossed by Fraser - o.g
Dumbarton (h)(L) corner right crossed by Fraser - Edjenguele scored

Long balls
Morton (h)(L) Long ball out of defence - Andre scored
St Mirren (a)(L) Long ball out of defence chased down by Murray, broke to Andre who scored

I have also completed the analysis for the whole season to date (up to Tues game)

Goals from crosses (open play)     11
Goals from crosses (setplays)        6
Goals from long balls                     3
Goals from counter attacks            1
Goals from open play                    12      (i.e from passing/possession game/through the middle etc)
Goals from penalties/Free Kicks      4      (includes VDV miss against Ayr which Murray scored rebound)
Goals from Individual skill               4      (includes dribble & shot & shots from outside the box
Total                                            41

Goals from (my definition of) open play account for 29% of the total. But the team in my estimation spends 80-90% of their time trying to score this way - not a great return for their efforts

One further interesting note is that only 2 of "open play" goals have been scored when we have either been level or behind, the other 10 were scored once we were leading. Clearly this suggests it is easier to score this way when you have a lead and not when we are chasing points.7 of the 11 crosses (ie excluding set plays) have given the team the lead.

These figures suggest that going wide and getting the ball and players into the box is the best way of getting a lead and that the tippy tappy stuff only bears fuit once we have established a lead.

If anyone thinks any of the above is helpful then my wee bit of effort will have been of some use. If anyone thinks its rubbish feel free to completely disregard it

PatReilly wrote:

Very detailed annanarab, but information like that can pose more questions than it solves.

Just returning to our match the other night, it was a goal from a corner. No dispute about that. 

But to gain the corner, Durnan, Andreu, Flood and VdV were involved in a series of passes through the middle, setting up Fraser who had the second of his attempts blocked for that corner.

You're not a descendent of Charles Reep, are you?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Reep 

 
I think the biggest question would be, how do you class a goal came from a cross when A few other players touch it or provide a through ball after it.
Doubt Andreu would be happy at losing his assist for Fraser's goal because obadeyi whipped in a shite cross just prior to his delicate pass   
Don't know if the boy Annan is related to shedka from mad, but he seems just as stubborn

PatReilly wrote:

Very detailed annanarab, but information like that can pose more questions than it solves.

Just returning to our match the other night, it was a goal from a corner. No dispute about that. 

But to gain the corner, Durnan, Andreu, Flood and VdV were involved in a series of passes through the middle, setting up Fraser who had the second of his attempts blocked for that corner.

You're not a descendent of Charles Reep, are you?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Reep 

Could well be (will have to dig out the family tree). I'm retired but shared his occupation and had a  background in performance management. Guess like Reep I'm developing another background in being misundestood  
 

lifesanocean wrote:

Great thread lads, keep it up.

 
In fairness, it's a frank exchange of opinions about what style of football we'd love me to see the team play.
Annan has brought his reasons and I've brought mine.
Kind of what you'd expect to see on a football message board.
After months of seeing threads about 'the baldy snake' and 'the Tim two' I'm happy to be discussing football.