Tekel Towers » Aberdeen vs United

RogerTheAlien · 03/3/2025 1:30 pm

There’s a split in the support when it comes to Jim Goodwin. Those who aren’t 100% set on him and those who are set on him. Whenever he does something questionable you always get hit with the “Oh negative fan, you want United to lose so you can moan” etc and when he wins it’s the “haters are quiet tonight”.

Well Jim, you’ve had a fair amount of credit in the bank this season but that was honking tactics and you cost us 3 massive points. Not even your biggest fans can defend that.

Stillliving · 03/3/2025 2:40 pm

Some on here seem determined to make this a black or white issue. As with most things its somewhere in between.
Yes JG is a coach who looks to defend a lead instead of trying to get another goal however if UTD had brought on Clarkson & Morris and Aberdeen brought on VDS & Fotheringham the 3pts would have ended up at Tannadice.

Shedtastic · 03/3/2025 3:00 pm

RogerTheAlien wrote:
There’s a split in the support when it comes to Jim Goodwin. Those who aren’t 100% set on him and those who are set on him. Whenever he does something questionable you always get hit with the “Oh negative fan, you want United to lose so you can moan” etc and when he wins it’s the “haters are quiet tonight”.

Well Jim, you’ve had a fair amount of credit in the bank this season but that was honking tactics and you cost us 3 massive points. Not even your biggest fans can defend that.

Think it was only 2 points.

Finn Seemann · 03/3/2025 3:11 pm

Morphman wrote:
Finn Seemann wrote:
I'm with CCX and Redford here. Difference was the strength off the bench. Aberdeen changed it and just started to run at us. With Gallagher off and a right back/mid at left back we were there for the taking. When Sibbald went off (gubbed), Campbell also looked like he had run his race and Sevelj had also put in a power of work. Babunski for me wasn't the right option. There was no time to put your foot on the ball. Haven't seen enough of Fiorini, but I'd have thought he was the better option than vdS. vdS is fine if we are chasing a game, not when we are trying to get one across the line. We really missed Ferry. Not because Luca didn't play well - he did, but because if we get to bring Luca on for Sibbald at 68 minutes we don't lose that game. Difference was a momentary lapse of concentration where we didn't close down in midfield and Jensen gets to play in Nisbet in a great position. Close that down, they don't score and we'd have seen it out. So we lost that because of squad depth. Some of that is on Goodwin, but we've had a go at him for being cautious before - he was away from home against a team above us and we took the game to them first half. We just ran out of steam - on to the Fun and picking up 3 points. This 2 week gap is great for us.
I partly agree with you here Finn but at the same time, I think Goodwin's decision making has to be questioned. Bringing on VdS for Sibbald was mental, and I can't be convinced that Babunski would've done worse for us. Putting on a centre forward, aware that some may disagree with calling VdS that btw, to play centre mid was a crazy decision.

If VdS was going to come on then it should have been for Dalby, who played well but looked knackered the last 20 mins. VdS one positive is he links play up well, and if anything we needed that up top with a midfielder such as Babunski or Fiorini taking the ball from the striker and picking the passes to the widemen to get us up the park.

Maybe I'm being harsh but I think the tiredness shown from the players also stemmed from the fact we set up to be so passive in the 2nd half. Mentally, it's easier to find that extra 10% when you're at least getting a few efforts on target and not just defending for 45 mins.

Fair points Morphman. vdS was definitely the wrong sub and I agree he'd have been better subbed for Dalby and Fiorini for Sibbs.

Others saying you are either for Goodwin or against him are wide of the mark. I'm not sold on him as he does make errors (the vdS subby), but what is he supposed to do here? He has a makeshift defence (a Holt replacement wouldn't have made a lot of difference - Graham fills that role) and a tiring midfield (due to one being in the defence). He's gone with width from the start (as we've been crying out for) and they're gubbed too. I'd have broguht on Fiorini instead of vDS, but I'm not the manager - I don't actually know where Fiorini is at. Fotheringham was on the face of it the right subby for Trapa - but maybe we let the wrong guy go to Falkirk? Kai didn't do anything.

Now Goodwin has to take the blame for losing 2 points, but we've gone to one of our closest rivals and nearly pulled off a great three points. I think people have short memories. Goodwin is having a good season. Let's judge him on next season. A close season to build the squad up again and a higher expectation that we can get Europe.

We'll finish top six and we'll get a chance to grab a Euro spot this year. I think we'll probably fall short, but we'll be in the mix. Not so long ago we were getting schooled by Raith Rovers...

Last edited by Finn Seemann (03/3/2025 3:23 pm)

redford_must_score · 03/3/2025 3:18 pm

Stillliving wrote:
Some on here seem determined to make this a black or white issue. As with most things its somewhere in between.
Yes JG is a coach who looks to defend a lead instead of trying to get another goal however if UTD had brought on Clarkson & Morris and Aberdeen brought on VDS & Fotheringham the 3pts would have ended up at Tannadice.

Agreed. And that's a very good way to look at it. If I was to put percentages on it, maybe 30% negative tactics/wrong choice of subs, and 70% Aberdeen's quality off the bench.

But even allowing for that superior quality off the bench I think better subs from us we just might have held out. Obviously can't prove that. VdS wrong sub in wrong position and gets massive criticism but Kai doesn't ?? What's going on with that because Kai is well below Prem quality.

Finn Seemann · 03/3/2025 3:27 pm

Got to say I like Shinnie's approach. Coming on at half-time he spends five minutes warming up and let's the crowd knows he means business. Leads by example and set the tone for the second half. We nearly rode our luck til the end though.

Conway11 · 03/3/2025 5:16 pm

One can only hope Babunski has told Goodwin to phuck off - most talented player on the bench, played out of position since he signed. He must listen to goodwin in training and think phuck me

BMT · 03/3/2025 5:30 pm

I still can’t understand how professional sports players can be gubbed after playing 3 games in a week and can only manage 60 minutes.
What am I missing here ?

Finn Seemann · 03/3/2025 6:08 pm

BMT wrote:
I still can’t understand how professional sports players can be gubbed after playing 3 games in a week and can only manage 60 minutes.
What am I missing here ?

Sibbs coming back from injury
Trapa (same I think) but less playing opportunities
Campbell not match fit (running out of that excuse though)
Dalby knocked his pan in with no support.

Everybody else seemed to last the 90 OK

Finn Seemann · 03/3/2025 6:10 pm

Conway11 wrote:
One can only hope Babunski has told Goodwin to phuck off - most talented player on the bench, played out of position since he signed. He must listen to goodwin in training and think phuck me

Sad to say Babunski is not suited to our game and also doesn't appear to have the engine to adapt. Odd that he was made captain etc..

No doubt he'd excel if the pace wasn't so stupid in our game.

Always_United · 03/3/2025 7:19 pm

Finn Seemann wrote:
Conway11 wrote:
One can only hope Babunski has told Goodwin to phuck off - most talented player on the bench, played out of position since he signed. He must listen to goodwin in training and think phuck me
Sad to say Babunski is not suited to our game and also doesn't appear to have the engine to adapt. Odd that he was made captain etc..

No doubt he'd excel if the pace wasn't so stupid in our game.

For reasons unknown to me, looking at his career stats he rarely plays more than 20 games a season, rarely scores or assists either. He never stays more than 1-2 seasons in one place either. It seems he's never really had a good run.

Tek · 03/3/2025 7:42 pm

I think Goodwin and Babunski have had a fall-out, JG subsequently wanted him away in January, and David Babunski has rejected any or all loan moves that were put to him.

Goodwin's taken the hump and the current situation is where we're at.

I'm surmising, of course, but i can't see any other good reason why else he wouldn't have started a game since December, or indeed barely played at all (only 1 minute versus Celtic and 4 minutes versus Hibs).

Has he set the World on fire? No.

But he has shown enough in a United jersey to still be considered someone worthy of starts and sub appearances. It's rather bizarre, particularly as since Babunski's last start, our form has generally fallen off a cliff.

redford_must_score · 03/3/2025 7:59 pm

Tek wrote:
I think Goodwin and Babunski have had a fall-out, JG subsequently wanted him away in January, and David Babunski has rejected any or all loan moves that were put to him.

Goodwin's taken the hump and the current situation is where we're at.

I'm surmising, of course, but i can't see any other good reason why else he wouldn't have started a game since December, or indeed barely played at all (only 1 minute versus Celtic and 4 minutes versus Hibs).

Has he set the World on fire? No.

But he has shown enough in a United jersey to still be considered someone worthy of starts and sub appearances. It's rather bizarre, particularly as since Babunski's last start, our form has generally fallen off a cliff.

You and I speculated about this before and I still agree that it's a likely scenario.
In the first few games he played in, the ball was rarely on the deck and I wonder if Babunski has gone in and challenged his tactics/style of play.
Maybe he said something that Goodwin took offence at.
Hopefully not, and I still think if played in a system that gets the best out of him there's a player in there. But long hopeful punts up to Dalby isn't that system 🙁

On the other hand it's great to see Trapanovski back and looking more like the player we thought we'd see.

Shakey Isles Arab · 03/3/2025 11:55 pm

Should have kept the foot on the gas and gone for 3 v 0 instead of which we were fortunate to scrape a point. - On you Jim.
Kai looked out his depth, Campbell anonymous.
Suffered the want of Ferry & Gallagher, but it's no like this is a great Sheep side.

Finn Seemann · 04/3/2025 11:30 am

Shakey Isles Arab wrote:
Should have kept the foot on the gas and gone for 3 v 0 instead of which we were fortunate to scrape a point. - On you Jim.
Kai looked out his depth, Campbell anonymous.
Suffered the want of Ferry & Gallagher, but it's no like this is a great Sheep side.

I thought Campbell was good on Sunday. Fell apart when he was left with vdS alongside him instead of Sibbald and looked out on his feet by the end, but he led the press (when it worked) and was a key part of us getting to 2-0 in the first place. Problem is that we have four competent defensive center-mids (Campbell, Sibblad, Sevelj and Stephenson) but our attacking centre-mids (Babunski and maybe Fiorini) aren't working. That is on Goodwin, but I don't think he should necessarily change it now. Play as we did at Pittodrie and we win 3 out of 4 of our remaining games. Outside Hearts maybe, none of the other teams can pressure us like Aberdeen did in the last 20 minutes.

Conway11 · 04/3/2025 1:06 pm

Van Der Sande comes on towards the end of a game, roams infront of the midfield just off the striker

Hes slow as phuck and couldnt hit a barn door.

Babunski is 10x the player if played in this position

Dont get goodwins logic

CCX2 2010 · 04/3/2025 1:52 pm

Conway11 wrote:
Van Der Sande comes on towards the end of a game, roams infront of the midfield just off the striker

Hes slow as phuck and couldnt hit a barn door.

Babunski is 10x the player if played in this position

Dont get goodwins logic

I would have replaced Sibbald with Babunski but I haven't been sold on Babunski since he's arrived.

I can't really recall a moment in any match where I thought he was controlling a game or was the main man, just another guy dropping deep and taking the ball off the feet of center backs where he's under zero pressure.

I have never seen him create very much in the short time he's been here either but that's just how I see him mate.

I agree with your sentiment around VDS I just don't see it either, just looks really clumsy and ineffective. A complete waste of time money and effort in the summer to bring him to the club imo.

But that was Goodwins options on Sunday as I seen it, I think he went with height due to Gallagher going off as the were launching it in quite a bit.

redford_must_score · 04/3/2025 2:40 pm

CCX2 2010 wrote:
Conway11 wrote:
Van Der Sande comes on towards the end of a game, roams infront of the midfield just off the striker

Hes slow as phuck and couldnt hit a barn door.

Babunski is 10x the player if played in this position

Dont get goodwins logic

I would have replaced Sibbald with Babunski but I haven't been sold on Babunski since he's arrived.

I can't really recall a moment in any match where I thought he was controlling a game or was the main man, just another guy dropping deep and taking the ball off the feet of center backs where he's under zero pressure.

I have never seen him create very much in the short time he's been here either but that's just how I see him mate.

I agree with your sentiment around VDS I just don't see it either, just looks really clumsy and ineffective. A complete waste of time money and effort in the summer to bring him to the club imo.

But that was Goodwins options on Sunday as I seen it, I think he went with height due to Gallagher going off as the were launching it in quite a bit.

Just a point of order on Babunski though. Can't remember which match it was early doors when he dinked a beautiful ball over the defenders head into Dalby who took one touch and swept it into the net.
He was played consistently out of position, wide right, wide left, holding, but rarely as a 10 which is what he is.

Shedtastic · 04/3/2025 3:01 pm

In the first derby Babunski played a great through ball to JVS who squared it for Trapanovski to score.

redford_must_score · 04/3/2025 3:04 pm

Shedtastic wrote:
In the first derby Babunski played a great through ball to JVS who squared it for Trapanovski to score.

Good memory there. Both these passes were played from the number 10 position.

Absolutely cracking goal that was too.
Same again in the coming derby please.

Last edited by redford_must_score (04/3/2025 3:29 pm)

Finn Seemann · 04/3/2025 3:13 pm

To be fair to Goodwin he found a winning formula that didn't include Babunski. It's only now that that formula seems to be failing that we are looking around to see what can improve us. I'm certainly not against Babunski getting a run at 10, but I think he has a lot to prove.

redford_must_score · 04/3/2025 3:34 pm

Finn Seemann wrote:
To be fair to Goodwin he found a winning formula that didn't include Babunski. It's only now that that formula seems to be failing that we are looking around to see what can improve us. I'm certainly not against Babunski getting a run at 10, but I think he has a lot to prove.

I agree. He looked half a yard short recently. And I don't think Goodwin will change the system for him.
I do think Goodwin will set up an attacking side in this coming derby but I'm not expecting to see Babunski in it.
My defence of him has been based simply on being played out of his favoured position when he has had a rare start.

CCX2 2010 · 04/3/2025 4:11 pm

redford_must_score wrote:
CCX2 2010 wrote:
Conway11 wrote:
Van Der Sande comes on towards the end of a game, roams infront of the midfield just off the striker

Hes slow as phuck and couldnt hit a barn door.

Babunski is 10x the player if played in this position

Dont get goodwins logic

I would have replaced Sibbald with Babunski but I haven't been sold on Babunski since he's arrived.

I can't really recall a moment in any match where I thought he was controlling a game or was the main man, just another guy dropping deep and taking the ball off the feet of center backs where he's under zero pressure.

I have never seen him create very much in the short time he's been here either but that's just how I see him mate.

I agree with your sentiment around VDS I just don't see it either, just looks really clumsy and ineffective. A complete waste of time money and effort in the summer to bring him to the club imo.

But that was Goodwins options on Sunday as I seen it, I think he went with height due to Gallagher going off as the were launching it in quite a bit.

Just a point of order on Babunski though. Can't remember which match it was early doors when he dinked a beautiful ball over the defenders head into Dalby who took one touch and swept it into the net.
He was played consistently out of position, wide right, wide left, holding, but rarely as a 10 which is what he is.

Fair point regarding he preffered position.

CCX2 2010 · 04/3/2025 4:16 pm

Finn Seemann wrote:
To be fair to Goodwin he found a winning formula that didn't include Babunski. It's only now that that formula seems to be failing that we are looking around to see what can improve us. I'm certainly not against Babunski getting a run at 10, but I think he has a lot to prove.

I agree and he has had to do that with so many injuries to key personnel which it appears is lost on some.

Despite that we are 3 points off 3rd which considering this time last year we were away to Morton is quite a turnaround.

Fingers crossed we can get a few of the guys back on the pitch for the Derby match.

Finn Seemann · 04/3/2025 5:56 pm

redford_must_score wrote:
Finn Seemann wrote:
To be fair to Goodwin he found a winning formula that didn't include Babunski. It's only now that that formula seems to be failing that we are looking around to see what can improve us. I'm certainly not against Babunski getting a run at 10, but I think he has a lot to prove.

I agree. He looked half a yard short recently. And I don't think Goodwin will change the system for him.
I do think Goodwin will set up an attacking side in this coming derby but I'm not expecting to see Babunski in it.
My defence of him has been based simply on being played out of his favoured position when he has had a rare start.

He has been played out of position and has probably has good reason to be far from the happiest camper, but I do think if he was 'at it' to use football parlance he would have been given more chances. FWIW I think he's probably had his last start for United and will be limited to the odd appearance from the bench. A pity as I think he's clearly a good influence. Wonder if he lost the backing of the dressing room too?