I’d keep the same and “freshen up” for the cup game. Can Sibbald handle it though? I’d rather have Sibbald for a half or 60 minutes than Harkes for 90 mind you. A win up there and favorable results elsewhere could see us in a great position compared to 2 weeks ago. 

Sibbald didn't play 90 minutes in either of the last 2 games so hopefully he's good to go again tomorrow. I would definitely keep him in the team. I'd be tempted to put Archie in for Levitt or McGrath, at least for the first half, to give them a break. Wouldn't make too many other changes, but would like to see Imme, Sadat and Pawlett all get 20 minutes in the 2nd half.

Unchanged.

Thought we were the best team by a long way.  3 good chances in the 1st half - Middleton x 2 and Watt's header from Freeman's cross.  Watt's Goal and Dylan's raker that hit the bar plus a couple of other half chances in the 2nd half.  They only had one chance which they scored - and that was a foul on Sibbald IMO - but of course he should have just put it out.

After the start we've had to the season. we need to look at the positives- 7 points from the last 3 games and we are back in the mix now- and we actually look like a team now.
 

Last edited by SlatefordArab (15/10/2022 10:30 pm)

Well I wasna at the game and unfortunately didna get to see it live on t'internet.

However saw the highlights later, and yeah we shoulda had a few more.

Halfway between bein chuffed to get a point and p1ssed off no to get the win.

Tangy wrote:

I get that the standard of refereeing isn't consistent (as a side nobody mentions good referee performances).

But the never played a game in their life is a poor argument.

Referees generally enter into the path at the bottom and work their way up. There's no fast track for the next willy collum. They progress through hard work, commitment and  success on the field and even at low levels are constantly observed by former referees.

As an idea of the commitment it takes to referee to progress up the tree, you are probably looking at doing a Saturday game and at least 1 Sunday game to start with. They will also be 2 training sessions a week organised by the local  referee association and probably 2 midweekers. That could be running the line at a Highland league u21 type level. So in all 6 days a week commitment for very little reward too.

There are also age limits - so if you sre waiting for a former player to retire and rise through the ranks, they would get to the top in time to retire.

Refereeing, as an ex ref who got nowhere near the top , is a huge commitment and not one which many people will take on. The mental pressures associated  are huge and I understand why some referees get influenced at parkhead and ibrox. Not to say its right but there's no TV replays or other angles - it's 1 guy in the middle of the park with a split second to make a decision

Lastly, I'd say ex players don't always know the rules but know their interpretation of the rules - so assuming an ex player did want to start at the bottom, they would have to re-learn the entire game before they could use their experience

 
A lot of good points there Tangy. There is no doubt that it takes a lot of commitment to reach grade 1 level in Scotland.
However if you reach the top in your early 30s you will have spent your weekends refereeing and not playing.
That leaves the argument that these modern referess know the laws but don't know the game.
When you look at Clancy, colum.... you know they have never been involved in a Sunday morning midfield battle on Drumgeith.

Tangy wrote:

I get that the standard of refereeing isn't consistent (as a side nobody mentions good referee performances).

But the never played a game in their life is a poor argument.

Referees generally enter into the path at the bottom and work their way up. There's no fast track for the next willy collum. They progress through hard work, commitment and success on the field and even at low levels are constantly observed by former referees.

As an idea of the commitment it takes to referee to progress up the tree, you are probably looking at doing a Saturday game and at least 1 Sunday game to start with. They will also be 2 training sessions a week organised by the local referee association and probably 2 midweekers. That could be running the line at a Highland league u21 type level. So in all 6 days a week commitment for very little reward too.

There are also age limits - so if you sre waiting for a former player to retire and rise through the ranks, they would get to the top in time to retire.

Refereeing, as an ex ref who got nowhere near the top , is a huge commitment and not one which many people will take on. The mental pressures associated are huge and I understand why some referees get influenced at parkhead and ibrox. Not to say its right but there's no TV replays or other angles - it's 1 guy in the middle of the park with a split second to make a decision

Lastly, I'd say ex players don't always know the rules but know their interpretation of the rules - so assuming an ex player did want to start at the bottom, they would have to re-learn the entire game before they could use their experience

No.
Don't think it is a poor argument. 

Indeed you rest my case with the background of what it takes to become a top ref.
At no stage does this ref grading include, far less give time for playing the game.
What I'm saying is that even a little bit of playing the game would improve standards

I appreciate the years of hard work & dedication you say it takes to become a top ref, but at no stage does it require having played the game, far less allow time to play.

Trust me, players know if a ref hasn't played the game   Players know what they can and can't get away with, which is why Ross County took advantage of Craig Napier to the fullest.

I'll give you an example of arguably Scotland's greatest ever referee - Tiny Wharton.
Today's tortuous path would never have allowed him to become a ref.
From the Gorbals, played at the school, moved up to amatuers, one day ref didn't show up and he got roped in to doing it.   ....tbf you wouldnae argue with him, and not because of the badge either.

(Which I think is the crux of the problem in that so many refs are jobsworth wee nyaffs hiding behind that badge.)

I'd say most of us give give credit where credit's due when refs are good - how often have you heard it said that the best ref is the one you never notice.

Bottom line - maybe just a little bit of time spent on practical rather than 100% technical.
 

Last edited by Shakey Isles Arab (17/10/2022 12:59 am)

What each ref sees as a foul, booking etc. is far too inconsistent across our top referees.  

I want to see some greater consistency between the application of the rules by our officials, they all receive the same training yet when they apply the rules there seems to be too much self interpretation.

It will soon get to the stage where you will need to scout the referee you have for each game to know what they will and will not penalise,  Having played the game or not should not really matter if they are properly trained, selected and supported by the SFA. 

Finn Seemann wrote:

For those who made the game, what was Djoum like?  Does he fill the obvious gap?

Looked miles off the pace, which is understandable, but wee touches and positioning shows that he is a quality player just need games imo.