Stillliving wrote:

By far the biggest problem in society is obesity
50% of kids and rising are overweight. weight related issue are by far the biggest financial issue for the NHS , costing the taxpayer billions. Obesity is killing Scotland
Alcohol & gambling addiction are relative side shows compared to this.
When I said I didn't care what was on the shirts I should maybe add as long as it's not a fast food logo.

Totally agree. Couldn’t believe the stuff my nephews/nieces were eating the last time I was back. Every single one of them (6 in total) were overweight and worryingly didn’t consider themselves overweight. A glass of coke with their tea(which was chips and processed fried garbage) for example. Don’t think I saw a vegetable(other than chips!) pass their lips. 
 

Responsible gambling is a huge part of our culture and thousands of United fans bet safely and within limits every week. Help is available through a variety of public and third sector organisations for the tiny minority who have a problem.

This partnership only serves to enhance that.

Just read the full press release. I'm OK with it. They are going to work with the community trust to educate about gambling etc.

As part of the season-long agreement, QuinnCasino will support the work of the Community Sports Trust, promoting education and awareness around responsible gambling.

I can't see what else they can do, really. Scottish football attracts companies which scottush football impacts. Alcohol and betting are synonymous with football in the UK and Scotland.

AlwaysUnited wrote:

One or two people need to frankly get a grip and join the real world. If you want to see the likes of the top scorer in the league, and other international players continue to sign, the club needs to monetise partnership opportunities.

If any United fan would like to "ethically" sponsor the club for the same money I imagine the chairman would probably like to hear from you.

Hahaha....dick.

If you think you are in the real world on this and those with some sort of moral compass are living in the past, then I think you've got a fair bit to learn.  Ethical business is not going away, it's only going to get stronger whether you like it or not.  This is a backward step for United.  One of the biggest German investor businesses has just been raided for being untruthful about what it is doing on sustainability.  This is not going away.  Gambling will be considered offside and we shouldn't be going there.  It actually shows how out of touch we are.

I'm not actually that bothered about a lot of what corporates are going to be bound to comply with going forward, but it is going to have an impact.  The only reason this will go nowhere as an issue is that ultimately United don't matter to the vast majority of people.

Arabdownsouth wrote:

If people want to gamble they will gamble, won't matter at all if we advertise it or not. I remember playing 3 card brag with my mates in my early teens and in my early adulthood had a bit of a gambling problem. I decided one day to stop so I stopped. Had absolutely nothing to do with advertising though. Only thing that matters to me about a United shirt is how good the lad wearing it is.

ADS, with respect, that's not really the point though is it.  Maybe you wouldn't have had a gambling problem if there was no advertising.  Maybe people who were not as lucky as you, who couldn't stop wouldn't have seen their lives end in turmoil and in some cases suicide.  I'm not talking about people who can 'handle' their gambling, drinking, smoking, drug taking etc. (I've certainly been fortunate enough to only have one of those 'vices'), I'm talking about those who can't.

There is no doubt that gambling is at its most base about ripping money from people who can't afford it.  In that sense it is no different from alcohol, smoking or drug 'abuse'.  It may be less offensive than the latter two and maybe even alcohol, but its still morally questionable.  To be clear, I am not advocating banning it, or anything like that, (I don't think you could), I'm just questioning whether it is appropriate for my football club to advertise it and my answer is no.  Sometimes in life things are more important than the money and for me this is one.  At the start of this debate, all I said was I won't be buying a shirt with that advertises gambling.  I normally buy two.  It is also another reason for me not to like the people running our club - the lack of moral conscience doesn't really surprise me though - it reinforces my view.
 

“Almost everyone gambles”

What is your authority on that? Or is that just your opinion?

“Ethical casino”

I think that might be an oxymoron.

Am I the only person who remembers Sean Quinn - Ireland richest man and the AIB scandal? He was bankrupted and sent to prison for contempt of court. Ok, maybe it his kids running the show, but only nominally.

I am surprised Taypools hasn't been brought up yet...

Tek wrote:

Macbonzo wrote:

“Almost everyone gambles”

What is your authority on that? Or is that just your opinion?

“Ethical casino”

I think that might be an oxymoron.

I can't believe i'm about to say this but....'i agree with AlwaysUnited'.

Almost everyone does have a gamble fairly often when you think of us putting on our football coupons, or a punt on a horse on Grand National/Royal Ascot Day, to our wives or girlfriends playing Wink Bingo or Foxy Bingo on their phones, to us all having a weekly flutter on the lottery, Euromillions etc.

If Quinn are going to work alongside the club to give info on responsible gambling, then i'm not sure there's much else the club can do tbh.

Gambling sponsorship isn't illegal after all (unlike say, tobacco firms).


 

I guess the 'almost' covers me then.  I don't gamble.  I had the odd bet when I was younger but soon began to understand how these businesses operate.  They don't gamble.  They are set up to take your money, eventually.  Ultimately they prey on weakness.  They can talk about safe gambling all they like but their MO is to take your money for zip in return.  I can't support that and I don't think my football club should either.  I may be in the minority here, but am confident I am in the right.

Arabdownsouth wrote:

Finn Seemann wrote:

Arabdownsouth wrote:

If people want to gamble they will gamble, won't matter at all if we advertise it or not. I remember playing 3 card brag with my mates in my early teens and in my early adulthood had a bit of a gambling problem. I decided one day to stop so I stopped. Had absolutely nothing to do with advertising though. Only thing that matters to me about a United shirt is how good the lad wearing it is.

ADS, with respect, that's not really the point though is it.  Maybe you wouldn't have had a gambling problem if there was no advertising.  Maybe people who were not as lucky as you, who couldn't stop wouldn't have seen their lives end in turmoil and in some cases suicide.  I'm not talking about people who can 'handle' their gambling, drinking, smoking, drug taking etc. (I've certainly been fortunate enough to only have one of those 'vices'), I'm talking about those who can't.

There is no doubt that gambling is at its most base about ripping money from people who can't afford it.  In that sense it is no different from alcohol, smoking or drug 'abuse'.  It may be less offensive than the latter two and maybe even alcohol, but its still morally questionable.  To be clear, I am not advocating banning it, or anything like that, (I don't think you could), I'm just questioning whether it is appropriate for my football club to advertise it and my answer is no.  Sometimes in life things are more important than the money and for me this is one.  At the start of this debate, all I said was I won't be buying a shirt with that advertises gambling.  I normally buy two.  It is also another reason for me not to like the people running our club - the lack of moral conscience doesn't really surprise me though - it reinforces my view.
 

 
Advertising had nothing to do with me gambling, I'm fairly sure of that. My point is really that regardless of advertising, people who have addictive tendencies will find their way to decline, people who are able to say no will do exactly that. I just don't think that someone who loses the mortgage money on the horses can realistically say that it wouldn't have happened if he hadn't got the idea from a football shirt. Everyone knows there's a bookies down the road, you don't need a football shirt to point it out. Of course you are absolutely entitled to keep your money in your pocket if the idea doesn't sit well with you though 👍

ADS, I think we just see this from different perspectives.  I agree with your general point that addiction is difficult to tackle.  However, we do as a nation restrict or have banned advertising for other addictions such as tobacco and to an extent alcohol.  The link with sport has always been an issue.  My issue is that most shirts are bought by/for kids.  Normalising gambling in this way is simply wrong and it is intended to grow the habit amongst younger people.  I'd far prefer the club to take slightly less cash from a more reputable sponsor.  I'd reward that by buying more from the club.

All this has made me realise that I also should have spoken out about having Eden Mill as a main sponsor too.

I've been reading and reflecting the comments here, and trying to square the moral circle in my own mind.

My conclusion is :

This sponsorship is aimed at people who already gamble, and plan to continue gambling. This sponsorship will not affect how much and how often they gamble. The purpose is to provide these people with an alternative product that may appeal to them. Its trying to poach them away from the existing market providers.

On the other hand, this sponsorship is NOT aimed at non-gamblers. There is no anticipation that someone with no interest in gambling will decide to become a gambler as a result of the advertisement on the kit.

AlwaysUnited wrote:

I've been reading and reflecting the comments here, and trying to square the moral circle in my own mind.

My conclusion is :

This sponsorship is aimed at people who already gamble, and plan to continue gambling. This sponsorship will not affect how much and how often they gamble. The purpose is to provide these people with an alternative product that may appeal to them. Its trying to poach them away from the existing market providers.

On the other hand, this sponsorship is NOT aimed at non-gamblers. There is no anticipation that someone with no interest in gambling will decide to become a gambler as a result of the advertisement on the kit.

I think that is a fairly naive approach to it - but if it helps you sleep at night...

Of course the kids wearing the strips are never going to be inquisitive enough to wonder what its all about - that would never happen...
 

No moral outrage at BetFred Cup, Ladbrokes SPFL or William Hills Scottish Cup?